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	<title>Comments on: REVIEW:  Secret Desires of A Gentleman by Laura Lee Guhrke</title>
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	<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2009 00:20:36 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Becky</title>
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		<dc:creator>Becky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Oct 2008 00:08:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Stephanie...
I agree with everything you wrote.  Until I read your post, I didn't even realize that everything was, indeed, all about Phillip, and it really is a testament to LLG's writing that I still sort of liked the book.  

Thank you for doing my thinking for me!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Stephanie&#8230;<br />
I agree with everything you wrote.  Until I read your post, I didn&#8217;t even realize that everything was, indeed, all about Phillip, and it really is a testament to LLG&#8217;s writing that I still sort of liked the book.  </p>
<p>Thank you for doing my thinking for me!</p>
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		<title>By: Stephanie</title>
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		<dc:creator>Stephanie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 23:02:26 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>After my two initial posts, I decided not to post further until I'd had another chance to look at this book and see if I could pinpoint what else bothered me about it--and Phillip, in particular.

Well, now I think I have the answer.  Beyond Phillip's snobbishness (and his dismaying inability to see it until it's forcibly pointed out to him), beyond his harsh treatment of Maria (both as a young girl and as a working woman), it's ALL ABOUT HIM. His wants, his needs, his feelings, his desires--secret and otherwise, his sense of duty, his position, his reputation, his pride, his so-called honor . . . for a little while, perhaps, it's about Lawrence too, but Phillip seems to view his brother as an extension of himself. Even as a boy, he selfishly keeps Maria's hair ribbon, despite knowing how upset she is over its loss because it belonged to her late mother. (At least when Roarke retained Eve's button in "Naked in Death," it came off an ugly suit that she didn't care for.)  

There must be scads of similarly self-centered heroes in romance, who become less so when they fall in love with the heroine. Unfortunately,  I'm not sure Phillip ever matures sufficiently to really think about Maria and what she might want or need, even after she practically spells it out for him during his high-handed proposals. And for me, that's a pretty big turn-off. It's a testament to LLG's writing ability that I didn't hate Phillip completely,  and, at times, I even felt a bit sorry for him. But that's a far cry from sympathizing with or rooting for him.

Still can't stand the last scene, with Phillip and Maria both doing inexplicable 180s, and all the complicated issues between them being handily swept under the rug. Because just saying "I love you" solves everything, doesn't it? ( /sarcasm)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>After my two initial posts, I decided not to post further until I&#8217;d had another chance to look at this book and see if I could pinpoint what else bothered me about it&#8211;and Phillip, in particular.</p>
<p>Well, now I think I have the answer.  Beyond Phillip&#8217;s snobbishness (and his dismaying inability to see it until it&#8217;s forcibly pointed out to him), beyond his harsh treatment of Maria (both as a young girl and as a working woman), it&#8217;s ALL ABOUT HIM. His wants, his needs, his feelings, his desires&#8211;secret and otherwise, his sense of duty, his position, his reputation, his pride, his so-called honor . . . for a little while, perhaps, it&#8217;s about Lawrence too, but Phillip seems to view his brother as an extension of himself. Even as a boy, he selfishly keeps Maria&#8217;s hair ribbon, despite knowing how upset she is over its loss because it belonged to her late mother. (At least when Roarke retained Eve&#8217;s button in &#8220;Naked in Death,&#8221; it came off an ugly suit that she didn&#8217;t care for.)  </p>
<p>There must be scads of similarly self-centered heroes in romance, who become less so when they fall in love with the heroine. Unfortunately,  I&#8217;m not sure Phillip ever matures sufficiently to really think about Maria and what she might want or need, even after she practically spells it out for him during his high-handed proposals. And for me, that&#8217;s a pretty big turn-off. It&#8217;s a testament to LLG&#8217;s writing ability that I didn&#8217;t hate Phillip completely,  and, at times, I even felt a bit sorry for him. But that&#8217;s a far cry from sympathizing with or rooting for him.</p>
<p>Still can&#8217;t stand the last scene, with Phillip and Maria both doing inexplicable 180s, and all the complicated issues between them being handily swept under the rug. Because just saying &#8220;I love you&#8221; solves everything, doesn&#8217;t it? ( /sarcasm)</p>
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		<title>By: MCHalliday</title>
		<link>http://dearauthor.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&amp;feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&amp;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fdearauthor.com%2Fwordpress%2F2008%2F10%2F02%2Freview-secret-desires-of-a-gentleman-by-laura-lee-guhrke%2F&amp;seed_title=REVIEW%3A++Secret+Desires+of+A+Gentleman+by+Laura+Lee+Guhrke/comment-page-1/#comment-175680</link>
		<dc:creator>MCHalliday</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Oct 2008 17:30:58 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Janet, your explanation is very clear. Inconsistency can be part of the growth arc of a much younger character but I find that trait unappealing in a businessman in his thirties, particularily as he appears well educated in his knowledge of true north as opposed to magnetic north ('true north' as an expression wasn't used until the 20th century).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Janet, your explanation is very clear. Inconsistency can be part of the growth arc of a much younger character but I find that trait unappealing in a businessman in his thirties, particularily as he appears well educated in his knowledge of true north as opposed to magnetic north (&#8217;true north&#8217; as an expression wasn&#8217;t used until the 20th century).</p>
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		<title>By: Michelle</title>
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		<dc:creator>Michelle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Oct 2008 16:20:07 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I'm a very big Laura Lee Guhrke fan and have read all her books.  This one was a disappointment that only gets worse with analysis.  If you are interested in the girl bachelor series, I definitely recommend And Then He Kissed Her.  If you're interested in more historical authenticity and detail, I'd recommend some of her older titles from harper monogram or pocket.  Breathless is very fun.

Secret Desires also seemed very short to me - shorter in page count and with a bigger font.  This shortness seemed to contribute to the characterization problems.

I also read this right after Sherry Thomas's Delicious, and I have to say the use of food and the heroine's love of cooking was more sophisticated in that novel.  This suffered in comparison, but I did like the authentic details about baking.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m a very big Laura Lee Guhrke fan and have read all her books.  This one was a disappointment that only gets worse with analysis.  If you are interested in the girl bachelor series, I definitely recommend And Then He Kissed Her.  If you&#8217;re interested in more historical authenticity and detail, I&#8217;d recommend some of her older titles from harper monogram or pocket.  Breathless is very fun.</p>
<p>Secret Desires also seemed very short to me - shorter in page count and with a bigger font.  This shortness seemed to contribute to the characterization problems.</p>
<p>I also read this right after Sherry Thomas&#8217;s Delicious, and I have to say the use of food and the heroine&#8217;s love of cooking was more sophisticated in that novel.  This suffered in comparison, but I did like the authentic details about baking.</p>
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		<title>By: Robin/Janet</title>
		<link>http://dearauthor.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&amp;feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&amp;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fdearauthor.com%2Fwordpress%2F2008%2F10%2F02%2Freview-secret-desires-of-a-gentleman-by-laura-lee-guhrke%2F&amp;seed_title=REVIEW%3A++Secret+Desires+of+A+Gentleman+by+Laura+Lee+Guhrke/comment-page-1/#comment-175647</link>
		<dc:creator>Robin/Janet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Oct 2008 00:47:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dearauthor.com/wordpress/?p=6737#comment-175647</guid>
		<description>Okay, so I've been thinking about the Phillip problem further, and the best way I can understand it myself is to compare him to Marcus from Lisa Kleypas's It Happened One Autumn.  Like Phillip, Marcus is reluctantly attracted to a girl who he believes to be socially unsuitable for him, but unlike Phillip, Marcus is portrayed as a figure of change (and the book is set quite a few years earlier, probably too early for his positive attitude toward turning his title toward business) and he comes to accept his attraction to Lillian more readily than Phillip accepts his attraction to Maria, IMO.

The tension within Marcus's character follows a more direct trajectory -- he is old fashioned in a way that does not fit his progressive ideas in another way, and so he adapts the old-fashioned part of himself to fit the rest of him.  And IMO he was never really cruel to Lillian, and he never set out to harm her financially or in any other way.  Also, we see him develop into the adoring, doting lover, the man we can trust has grown beyond the petty attitudes toward Lillian's American directness and modernity.  In other words, Marcus shows a character consistently I didn't detect in Phillip, with a more coherent rendering of a similar personal inconsistency, if that makes any sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Okay, so I&#8217;ve been thinking about the Phillip problem further, and the best way I can understand it myself is to compare him to Marcus from Lisa Kleypas&#8217;s It Happened One Autumn.  Like Phillip, Marcus is reluctantly attracted to a girl who he believes to be socially unsuitable for him, but unlike Phillip, Marcus is portrayed as a figure of change (and the book is set quite a few years earlier, probably too early for his positive attitude toward turning his title toward business) and he comes to accept his attraction to Lillian more readily than Phillip accepts his attraction to Maria, IMO.</p>
<p>The tension within Marcus&#8217;s character follows a more direct trajectory &#8212; he is old fashioned in a way that does not fit his progressive ideas in another way, and so he adapts the old-fashioned part of himself to fit the rest of him.  And IMO he was never really cruel to Lillian, and he never set out to harm her financially or in any other way.  Also, we see him develop into the adoring, doting lover, the man we can trust has grown beyond the petty attitudes toward Lillian&#8217;s American directness and modernity.  In other words, Marcus shows a character consistently I didn&#8217;t detect in Phillip, with a more coherent rendering of a similar personal inconsistency, if that makes any sense.</p>
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		<title>By: Robin/Janet</title>
		<link>http://dearauthor.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&amp;feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&amp;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fdearauthor.com%2Fwordpress%2F2008%2F10%2F02%2Freview-secret-desires-of-a-gentleman-by-laura-lee-guhrke%2F&amp;seed_title=REVIEW%3A++Secret+Desires+of+A+Gentleman+by+Laura+Lee+Guhrke/comment-page-1/#comment-175582</link>
		<dc:creator>Robin/Janet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Oct 2008 00:47:50 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;i&gt;The main reason for the shift was the peers need for vast amounts of money to fill depleted coffers and restore estates.&lt;/i&gt;

And Phillip had already turned to trade via the family shipping business, so his attitudes were particularly frustrating to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>The main reason for the shift was the peers need for vast amounts of money to fill depleted coffers and restore estates.</i></p>
<p>And Phillip had already turned to trade via the family shipping business, so his attitudes were particularly frustrating to me.</p>
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		<title>By: MCHalliday</title>
		<link>http://dearauthor.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&amp;feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&amp;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fdearauthor.com%2Fwordpress%2F2008%2F10%2F02%2Freview-secret-desires-of-a-gentleman-by-laura-lee-guhrke%2F&amp;seed_title=REVIEW%3A++Secret+Desires+of+A+Gentleman+by+Laura+Lee+Guhrke/comment-page-1/#comment-175560</link>
		<dc:creator>MCHalliday</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Oct 2008 17:50:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Janet, I so appreciate a reply to my comment and have the same reservations with the hero as you. Phillip's attitude was mired in the religious mid-Victorian view point and beyond his lifelong relationship with Maria, there was no true basis for his pretentions; social status was of no real importance to the aristocracy by 1895. The main reason for the shift was the peers need for vast amounts of money to fill depleted coffers and restore estates. Add to historical inaccuracy that Phillip seems not to require a dowry, a bride's family wealth was a marriage prerequisite for titled men of the day.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Janet, I so appreciate a reply to my comment and have the same reservations with the hero as you. Phillip&#8217;s attitude was mired in the religious mid-Victorian view point and beyond his lifelong relationship with Maria, there was no true basis for his pretentions; social status was of no real importance to the aristocracy by 1895. The main reason for the shift was the peers need for vast amounts of money to fill depleted coffers and restore estates. Add to historical inaccuracy that Phillip seems not to require a dowry, a bride&#8217;s family wealth was a marriage prerequisite for titled men of the day.</p>
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		<title>By: Robin/Janet</title>
		<link>http://dearauthor.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&amp;feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&amp;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fdearauthor.com%2Fwordpress%2F2008%2F10%2F02%2Freview-secret-desires-of-a-gentleman-by-laura-lee-guhrke%2F&amp;seed_title=REVIEW%3A++Secret+Desires+of+A+Gentleman+by+Laura+Lee+Guhrke/comment-page-1/#comment-175497</link>
		<dc:creator>Robin/Janet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Oct 2008 08:28:51 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;b&gt;Corrine&lt;/b&gt;:  I don't know the answer to that, but I'm leaving the review grade as it was originally posted, along with my follow-up comments, so people can draw their own conclusions.  

&lt;b&gt;Becky&lt;/b&gt;:  I don't find Phillip confusing in the way I find a *person* whose motivations are opaque confusing.  I find him more incoherent in the way of a character who is inexplicably inconsistent, if that makes any sense.  Because when an author creates a character, she may create him as unself-conscious and conflicted, but IMO even (especially?) that kind of characterization needs to be coherent at a meta level, which Phillip wasn't for me.  In other words, he may not understand himself, but we need to understand him in order for his journey (and the relationship with the heroine) to make sense.

&lt;b&gt;MCHalliday&lt;/b&gt;:  One of the mitigating factors in Phillip's relationship to Maria was the fact that they had really grown up together in the same household.  So while there was a very real difference in social position from the start, Phillip's attitudes toward Maria IMO smacked of that virgin/whore dichotomy that was so prevalent in the mid-Victorian period. So it wasn't that I expected him to be fully 'democratic' in his social attitudes toward class, but that he treated Maria with dishonor, which, as you pointed out in your comment, would not be part of a gentleman's code of behavior, especially a gentleman who had grown up with and been very close to Maria.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>Corrine</b>:  I don&#8217;t know the answer to that, but I&#8217;m leaving the review grade as it was originally posted, along with my follow-up comments, so people can draw their own conclusions.  </p>
<p><b>Becky</b>:  I don&#8217;t find Phillip confusing in the way I find a *person* whose motivations are opaque confusing.  I find him more incoherent in the way of a character who is inexplicably inconsistent, if that makes any sense.  Because when an author creates a character, she may create him as unself-conscious and conflicted, but IMO even (especially?) that kind of characterization needs to be coherent at a meta level, which Phillip wasn&#8217;t for me.  In other words, he may not understand himself, but we need to understand him in order for his journey (and the relationship with the heroine) to make sense.</p>
<p><b>MCHalliday</b>:  One of the mitigating factors in Phillip&#8217;s relationship to Maria was the fact that they had really grown up together in the same household.  So while there was a very real difference in social position from the start, Phillip&#8217;s attitudes toward Maria IMO smacked of that virgin/whore dichotomy that was so prevalent in the mid-Victorian period. So it wasn&#8217;t that I expected him to be fully &#8216;democratic&#8217; in his social attitudes toward class, but that he treated Maria with dishonor, which, as you pointed out in your comment, would not be part of a gentleman&#8217;s code of behavior, especially a gentleman who had grown up with and been very close to Maria.</p>
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		<title>By: MCHalliday</title>
		<link>http://dearauthor.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&amp;feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&amp;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fdearauthor.com%2Fwordpress%2F2008%2F10%2F02%2Freview-secret-desires-of-a-gentleman-by-laura-lee-guhrke%2F&amp;seed_title=REVIEW%3A++Secret+Desires+of+A+Gentleman+by+Laura+Lee+Guhrke/comment-page-1/#comment-175465</link>
		<dc:creator>MCHalliday</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Oct 2008 21:09:50 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>"I guess the thing that bothers me most about Phillip is how hidebound he is in his attitude that birth and class trump everything, including education, hard work, and skill. I’d find this more believable earlier in the century, but in 1895, the social order was changing. People in England and elsewhere were proving that they didn’t have to be born aristocrats to become wealthy, respected, and respectable." (Block quote not available)

In 1895 England, things were changing a wee bit but there remained a huge chasm between the working class and the aristocracy, well into the twentieth century. If Maria had been respectably supported and not chosen to become a 'skilled worker', Phillip would have had less apprehension inspite of his Victorian conventions. The Queen frowned upon working women and this was an accepted attitude for both middle and upper classes. 

Janet indicated historical inaccuracies in her review and further to that, obtaining a leasehold in bustling Piccadilly would have been an incredible, if not near impossible, feat for woman without male represention. Also, manners and chivalry in the latter nineteenth century were important to an honourable gentleman; malicious words spoken to a woman of good virtue would have been viewed as horrendous. IMHO, Maria's intelligence should have afforded the ability to see his lack of respect for her; independence and success should have ensured she kept away from such a man.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I guess the thing that bothers me most about Phillip is how hidebound he is in his attitude that birth and class trump everything, including education, hard work, and skill. I’d find this more believable earlier in the century, but in 1895, the social order was changing. People in England and elsewhere were proving that they didn’t have to be born aristocrats to become wealthy, respected, and respectable.&#8221; (Block quote not available)</p>
<p>In 1895 England, things were changing a wee bit but there remained a huge chasm between the working class and the aristocracy, well into the twentieth century. If Maria had been respectably supported and not chosen to become a &#8217;skilled worker&#8217;, Phillip would have had less apprehension inspite of his Victorian conventions. The Queen frowned upon working women and this was an accepted attitude for both middle and upper classes. </p>
<p>Janet indicated historical inaccuracies in her review and further to that, obtaining a leasehold in bustling Piccadilly would have been an incredible, if not near impossible, feat for woman without male represention. Also, manners and chivalry in the latter nineteenth century were important to an honourable gentleman; malicious words spoken to a woman of good virtue would have been viewed as horrendous. IMHO, Maria&#8217;s intelligence should have afforded the ability to see his lack of respect for her; independence and success should have ensured she kept away from such a man.</p>
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		<title>By: Becky</title>
		<link>http://dearauthor.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&amp;feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&amp;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fdearauthor.com%2Fwordpress%2F2008%2F10%2F02%2Freview-secret-desires-of-a-gentleman-by-laura-lee-guhrke%2F&amp;seed_title=REVIEW%3A++Secret+Desires+of+A+Gentleman+by+Laura+Lee+Guhrke/comment-page-1/#comment-175455</link>
		<dc:creator>Becky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Oct 2008 19:51:36 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Yes, I do hate when that happens.  I probably would have just felt vaguely dissatisfied about the book, but now I'm specificially dissapointed.  Oh, well.  I'm stil a LLG fan.  I do still like the character of Maria (until the end), and I don't hate the character of Phillip.  I just find him confusing.  This is some faint praise, huh?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, I do hate when that happens.  I probably would have just felt vaguely dissatisfied about the book, but now I&#8217;m specificially dissapointed.  Oh, well.  I&#8217;m stil a LLG fan.  I do still like the character of Maria (until the end), and I don&#8217;t hate the character of Phillip.  I just find him confusing.  This is some faint praise, huh?</p>
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