First of all, I’m not quite sure what this column is trying to say–that whites need to write more people of color into their stories? Okay, but how would we minorities feel if whites dictated to us about the proper color balance of our stories? (Yes, for the record, I am a minority.) First of all, no one should EVER feel entitled to demand anything of a writer as far as subject-matter, racial make-up of characters, setting, tone, etc. etc. It’s your story–if you want to write about Appalachians, go for it. If you want to write about Africans, godspeed. If it is good, it will be believable. If your characters are well-drawn, your race won’t matter, and neither will the race of your characters.

In fact, there’s no such thing as a racist text–just a bad text. Racial stereotypes are the fodder of bad writers. When I come across racist stereotypes in fiction, I dismiss the story as poorly written, badly conceived, and just a waste of time. Such stories are usually not propaganda, though they may reflect damaging cultural attitudes. Truly, these stories are told by uncreative, untalented minds, and they won’t last.

Second of all, if we minorities want to see more minorities in stories, then we have to write them. We CANNOT blame white people for not wanting to write outside of their culture, just as they can’t blame us for not eagerly writing about suburban whites. It’s absurd! Novels aren’t affirmative action programs. You can’t employ some system of tokenism to try to even out the injustices of society. What an INSULT to the human imagination.

There’s nothing wrong with stories about white people doing “white upper-class things.” Just as there’s nothing wrong with Puerto Ricans doing Puerto Rican things. The kind of attitude that Handyhunter is promoting–one that essentializes cultures and dismisses stories by certain groups of people simply because of who they are or where they grew up or what they like to do–is a dangerous one, one that would seem extreme, offensive, and downright hateful if directed toward non-whites.

I encourage everyone to just calm down and walk away from this one. This column is not worth getting yourselves worked up about. It’s a poorly written and poorly crafted essay that seems little more than a straw-man argument that a college freshman might write to piss off his composition teacher. That’s all.

Romance suffers from the same problem SF/F does. It's very, very white.

I personally do not have a problem with white characters, nor do I view the presence of white characters in books as something “defective” or “problematic.”

Ms. Hunter appears to take greater issue against white characters in romance than she does against the lack of POC in romance and SF/F.

It would also seem that readers are far more okay with reading about vampires and werewolves and demons and angels than characters of colour. That is not okay.

Why is it “not okay” for readers to prefer genres most appealing to readers? For that matter, comparison of paranormal characters to POC demonstrates poor logic. I and other authors have written paranormal characters of color. Paranormal characters are more a separate species (from human) than a separate race/color.

It is not diversity to have white people running around in foreign lands without much thought to the people who are native to those lands. I can't say I find it romantic when they're in the middle of colonizing another country either; I'm not sure how I'm supposed to root for our heroes when they're killing or enslaving other people, or condoning/profiting from it, even if they aren't actively participating (this is an issue even when white characters don't visit foreign lands, but it's a bit harder to ignore, I think, when they're in the middle of taking over another country).

1. Not every author writes a book with the intent of promoting diversity. Nor should they.

2. I have no problem with accurate historical novels. I comprehend the concept “that was then, this is now.” As for the killing/enslaving/exploitation, Whites hardly hold a corner on that market. I don’t have a problem with historical fiction depicting “whites taking over another country” in instances where that is historical fact. For that matter, I have no problem with historical fiction demonstrating blacks taking over land/property that presumably belonged to someone else (check historical records of royal land grants, white people alone did not receive them.) People who have issues with history…don’t read historicals, I guess.

Wow. This is such an anti-White hatefully charged post, it’s amazing to me this site permitted it.

The point of ‘white privilege' is not that white people believe themselves more privileged but that by virtue of the way our society is, we are privileged in a whole host of ways we often do not even notice. Of course you are right to say that not all white people are the same and we do not all enjoy the same privileges. And yes, being poor will mean that there are many privileges you don't have.

But – and this is the point of having the debate here – you do have, by virtue simply of your colour, the privilege of being able to pick up almost any romance novel and find a heroine who has the same skin tone as you, without need for any discussion or defence of that fact. You may not regard that as a privilege, but for those women who cannot do the same, you are unquestionably in a privileged position in this respect.

I’m uninterested in entertaining lengthy debate on the subject, but it’s possible for ANY person or group to point at another person or group and cite that person/group enjoying advantage/privilege the other person/group doesn’t enjoy. “The grass always looks greener,” etc..

That said, I’ve no intention of arm-wrestling the alleged unprivileged group/person out of its beliefs. Perception influences reality. If someone’s convinced the color of a band-aid demonstrates “unfair” or “unearned” advantage, so be it.

I’ve never faced racial prejudice from “white” people, I’ve experienced more than a little “colorism” prejudice from people identifying as another race.

My perspective: “white” writers (whether ‘real white’ or ‘white enough to be considered a member of the dominant group’) cannot hope for a break when it comes to writing characters of alternative race and/or culture.

If the “white” writer does a good job and gets it right, there’s praise, but there’s also an underlying resentment directed to the writer’s success, the idea that it would be more beneficial for a writer of color to succeed instead of the “white” writer.

If a “white” writer does a lousy job, features unwholesome stereotypes, etc., s/he is mocked or attacked, is accused of “racism,” and faces all manner of criticism.

If a “white” writer eschews characters of color, that’s put down as “white privilege” and “exclusion.”

I, for one, enjoy developing characters of diverse backgrounds and experiences. I’ve faced my share of criticism for it. If I write about wealthy Black planters or tradesmen utilizing slave labor in the Antebellum era, I’m accused of dishonesty (if the reader is ignorant of the fact that Black planters/slaveowners thrived in the South) OR I’m “portraying (Blacks) in a negative light and ignoring the evils of slavery.”

If I point out American Indians captured and enslaved European and Black people, sometimes torturing them to death, I am “corrected” by people who “know” that American Indians adopted captives into their tribes, the captives were all well-treated and lived happily with the Indians, etc.

It seems like many people want stereotypes of the “white = greedy, saddistic, exploitative, opportunisitc” and “not white = spiritual, beautiful, non-violent, accepting all races/cultures, knowledgeable/in tune with Mother earth, morally superior to the white man…”

Mostly, I write my characters as characters. It really doesn’t matter what one’s color/racial identity is. Humans have varying motives and their behavior has more to do with character than color. Regardless of race/cultural identity, a person can be a hero/ine or a villain/ess, good or evil, loving or abusive, scrupulous or unprincipled.

I don’t feel I “owe” it to a particular race/culture to portray characters of their race/culture in the best possible light. I don’t “owe” it to minorities to portray whites in the worst possible light. I owe ALL readers a good story.

Right now I’m “cooking” on a plotline of an Antebellum, biracial heroine who inherits a fortune from her white father. Impossible? Look up Amanda America Dickson’s bio. Truth is always stranger than fiction.

Yes, that’s it exactly. Thank you!

(I don’t mean white people shouldn’t write POC – or POC of one culture shouldn’t write POC of other cultures – but if, say, criticism of the story comes up by a POC, I think it’s worth listening to because, well, maybe we know a little bit more about what it’s like to be a person of colour.)

I spent a couple of years living in the US recently and one of the things I was very struck by was just how differently the whole racial issue is configured there. Of course we have racial tensions and issues in the UK, but they are different from those in the US. Broadly speaking, our problems stem from large-scale, relatively recent (within the last 50 years) immigration – largely from India and Pakistan, from the Caribbean, and more recently from Eastern Europe. Though of course many immigrants will have worked the worst kinds of jobs, there isn’t a big history of immigrants in domestic service, largely because domestic service had all but died out by the 1950′s. Of course some will have been office cleaners and so on, but the majority will have been involved in industrial work – on the docks, in the factories and so on. It’s possible that I’m wrong about this, but I don’t think a British black person would respond in quite the same way to my character as you did.

Which again illustrates some of the things that we have been talking about. The stories here are different from the stories in the US, and stories in other places around the world. It’s not that any one of these stories is right, and the others wrong, but it is that we need to hear – and therefore tell – all these stories.

Thanks so much for taking the time to explain the difference regarding PHD’s.
I think cultural history plays into it more than not when writing a POC in fiction.
I guess I just wondered why her job would be as a cleaning lady, instead of the example of yourself, a secretarial job perhaps. I don’t mean to imply that a cleaning lady isn’t a worthy profession, so I hope those reading this will forgive me. It could be the cultural history in the US I’m falling back on, in regarding POC and domestic positions, as many times in real life those are long, hard hours for little pay. However, many a child has been put through college or a home bought through those jobs, with the parents wanting a better life for their offspring. In the US, while a parent might be a custodian or domestic, once their child is in college they look for other occupations to suppliment their income. It’s the “wanting better for my child than I had.” Yet in these tough economic times, I could see where that could possibly be the only alternative to get ahead.

Btw, PhD’s work differently in the UK – you might not have a Masters, you often won’t have full funding. Yes you can get teaching jobs, but they aren’t always worth the time for the money. I am partly-funding mine at the moment by doing some not-much-more-than-minimum-wage secretarial work. I hope it’s clear in the story why my character is doing this. She definitely gets (imo) the best line in the whole book! And yes, Lisa, I’d love to write her story one day. I’ll put that on the list!

“She appears in the novel as a part-time cleaning lady, supplementing her funding for a PhD in bio-molecular physics. She also acts as the style-guru for my clueless MC”

Ros, I commend you for adding a character of color, but I kinda cringed at the second line. So often POC and gay and lesbian characters are thrust into the role of a sidekick, with no life of their own (not saying that’s what you’ve done, your character may have a very full life and you may have woven this into the story) save for being a style guru/jokester/confidant. And I might have to ask why someone going for their PHD would act as a style guru (I know individuals who’ve gotten their Bachelors while working as cooks and cleaners, but this is the first one going for a PHD. Not saying it isn’t done, but once you get your Masters over in the US, you should be able to get a higher paying job than cleaning lady). I guess I’m a bit sensitive to this because in the US, many books and movies have a POC acting as the “urban” style coach, while its basically all about the MC.

Please don’t think I’m jumping on you, because that is not my intent and I would welcome a conversation on this. I just thought I’d point it out, and I’m only one opinion. What we are discussing is not an easy thing to do, so I commend you for putting it out here. When I began reading this thread, I started work on an on-line graphic novel that focuses on inter-racial couplings in a paranormal world. I state this because when it came time to assign attributes, I thought long and hard about whether I should make the African American male a werewolf or a warlock. Yeah, silly huh?

While that may seem innocent at first glance, if not done right, it could offend. See, a werewolf in popular fiction is barechested and enraged most often, and I don’t want anyone to think that’s the default position for a black male. So I decided to make him more deliberately laid back, in possession of an ancient, cerebral wolf power.

So I thought to change him to a wizard, until I realized I didn’t want to hear him described as a witch doctor, since I plan on adding a back story of his African roots (sorry, but I saw some protesters with Obama photoshopped as a witch doctor and that image galls me). Then I created an Asian character and made him a Gorgon. But after some research, I decided to make him the Wizard. Why? because I rarely read any fiction with Asian characters dealing with magic, though hopefully, someone on here can point me to some good paranormal romance where this is so. After reading Barbara’s comments, I decided to create a tall Valkyrie who’s African American. But I didn’t want her with long flowing hair. So for her backstory, I decided that even though she was on Chemo-therapy, she tried to stop a kid from being mugged and was almost killed. Because of her bravery she was made into a Valkyrie, because, after reading I think it was Angela’s comments, why do writers in paranormal act as if there would be no friction between races?
I decided that since the Valkyries I read about are usually non-minority, her inclusion rubs some the wrong way, and it will make for a good storyline I believe. Anyway, I write this way too long insight into my own deliberations as a POC to say, I wish you well, and we all have reservations at some point. Oh, and the non-minority hunk just became the gorgon.

I have to write the stories that I think I can tell, and if that includes characters from different ethnic and racial backgrounds from me, I have to do my best to write them well and to tell a range of different stories for them.

I maintain the Danger Gal Blog where I profile female characters, usually in science fiction, who subvert common stereotypes. I’ve often made the point that if the gender of a character makes no difference in a story that I wish fewer stories defaulted to male — and the same idea holds true for characters of color. If we do our characterization homework, a character’s ethnicity should be examined and if the message of the story or the facet of life I’m picking apart has nothing to do with ethnicity then I should consider all possible ethnic backgrounds. This means that I have stories to tell with protagonists who are POC and their ethnicity is not the focus of the story, but certainly it will influence how they see their world. I hope that makes sense. So many stories with characters of color focus on ethnicity, so I have no idea if there’s a place for my approach. Maybe that’s just another example of my only experience being with a particular “single story?”

She appears in the novel as a part-time cleaning lady, supplementing her funding for a PhD in bio-molecular physics.

Please tell me that this character gets her own book next.

At the moment, the conclusion I’ve come to – and I am not trying to suggest that this is the ‘right’ answer, or that every writer should do the same – is that I have to write the stories that I think I can tell, and if that includes characters from different ethnic and racial backgrounds from me, I have to do my best to write them well and to tell a range of different stories for them. I’m British and I write stories set in the UK, so there are a plethora of different non-white and non-English stories to be told.

I have just submitted my first novel to M&B. It’s set mainly in London and in my mind one of the secondary characters was definitely a typical East-London black girl. She appears in the novel as a part-time cleaning lady, supplementing her funding for a PhD in bio-molecular physics. She also acts as the style-guru for my clueless MC. I thought really long and hard about whether I wanted to say explicitly that she was black – given that I didn’t make a point of saying any of my white characters were white – and in the end I didn’t. I know this means that many readers will default to the assumption that this character is white, too, and maybe another time I’d make a different choice. I’m also thinking about my next story and whether one of the protagonists – probably the hero would fit best – might work well as a non-white character. I’m a bit nervous, because the content of the story would play straight into the ‘black men can dance’ stereotype, so I’d like to try to find a way to subvert that somehow.

Sorry, too rambling and off topic. I guess I’m just feeling that this whole area is always more complicated and maybe there aren’t ‘right’ choices (though there are certainly ‘wrong’ ones) – we just have to keep trying, failing, trying again and failing better.

Or when POC assert that we might know our stories better than other people writing us?

Does this mean that as a white writer I shouldn’t even try to tell stories with protagonists who are POC? I’m genuinely wondering, not trying to be confrontational. Would even my attempt be condescending no matter how good my intentions or in-depth my research because these aren’t my stories to tell? I ask because I know there’s no possible way I can get it 100% right no matter how hard I try. In most things it’s better to try and fail rather than to not try at all, but does that hold for this?

I understand you're simplifying, but Silko is Native American and Kingston is Chinese-American -’ there are some shared issues, but it's not all the same. The impact on Native Americans when European settlers migrated to the New World – the continuing erasure of them – is not the same as Chinese people migrating to America. But I think you know this?

Yup, but do you really think it’s as clear as part Native American v. child of Chinese immigrants? I’m very wary of making that leap, and not just because Silko is actually mixed heritage (Anglo, Mexican, and Laguna, IIRC). Gerald Vizenor, for example, would, I think, share Kingston’s POV. Both are very fond of the trickster figure, even though Vizenor, as Chippewa, might superficially be aligned more closely with Silko.

There are so many issues here, as you know, from the nature of the sacred, the nature of culture (I keep thinking, too, of Homi Bhabha’s theories of cultural hybridity), the construction of race and ethnicity, the rhetoric of nationhood, matriarchal v. patriarchal societies (i.e. the Laguna are matriarchal), the substantive differences among indigenous nations (members of the Iroquois Confederacy, for example, controlled the Eastern part of what’s now the US through the reduction of Canada in 1763 and so had a very different experience of Anglo imposition than the Chippewa or the Pueblo or the Crow/Absarokee, etc.). Then there is the question of how each person identifies themselves as part of culture, how they represent that in their work, how that does and does not conform to the historical experiences that others in their general racial/cultural/ethnic cohort might define them, etc. Oy, just thinking about it is overwhelming, lol. In any case, it’s most definitely an amazing example of how difficult these questions of representation and appropriation are, which circles back to your original call for more awareness and understanding re. the Romance genre.

Why do people think this when POC ask to be taken seriously or like normal human beings? Or when POC assert that we might know our stories better than other people writing us?

@Robin: Romance has often relied on *invented history* that has, because of the way it's been passed from book to book, author to author, reader to reader, has taken on an air of authenticity that is completely artificial (on Twitter I compared bad history to an STD in the genre, indiscriminately passed around).

Heh. Relatedly, I wish more people would look at history as a living, breathing, evolving creature that changes as we find out more about it, sometimes by shifting perspective a little (away from the white male gaze).

So not only does it take real sensitivity and awareness on the part of the author, but it requires a certain breaking through reader expectations set by the norms of the genre.

Yes, it’s why I wish there were more awareness and discussion of race and appropriation.

I will just say that I once witnessed a very interesting debate between Leslie Marmon Silko and Maxine Hong Kingston, who were arguing about whether cultural symbols should/could be appropriated and re-signified by other cultures. Kingston's position was yes, no symbol was “owned” by a culture and the fluidity of culture made such transformation inevitable, while Silko insisted that cultures should be able to retain the integrity of their symbols, that transfer was inseparable from domination, and that transformation should not be supported and viewed as positive (I'm *massively* paraphrasing and simplifying here). Obviously, it's an ongoing debate.

Yes, POC have different opinions and different experiences, even within the same race and culture. I think context/history is an important factor; I understand you’re simplifying, but Silko is Native American and Kingston is Chinese-American — there are some shared issues, but it’s not all the same. The impact on Native Americans when European settlers migrated to the New World – the continuing erasure of them – is not the same as Chinese people migrating to America. But I think you know this?

I really don’t see the problem. In a sentence or two they’re set straight. I can hardly fault them for trying to be helpful, even if they failed at it.

We all make assumptions and have biases.

But that’s never (or at least not today) going to get through to some. And I have a sick kid and no sleep, so how coherent would I be? Thank you for hosting this thread, and thank you Jade Lee for your honesty. I read very little HQN so I didn’t pay any attention to the promos I saw. Earlier this morning I bought a Carolyn Jewell novel as a result of one of her comments – I’m headed back to my e-book store of choice to pick up some Concubine and … wait…. I already have it!!! I bought it in a bundle (on someone’s suggestion) and didn’t read it yet.

I’m buying something backlist. Because the way we vote is 20% with out words and 80% with our money. Change comes from breaking out of our patterns and putting our money where our mouth is.

tried to teach him how to use a toilet -’ as if he didn't already know!

As to the toilets and knowing how to use them, I’ll relate a story from my July trip to Germany. I and several of the American ladies who were on the plane with me sought out the bathrooms right after arrival.

I overheard them saying that there was no way to flush and how gross that was. A couple left without even trying to figure it out. I was able to explain to the others how to use this particular system.

I recently stayed at a 3 star hotel here in the U.S. If there hadn’t been instructions on how to use that particular shower (three different steps required to turn on and get warm water) I would have never figured it out on my own.

I know your example was trying to show cultural insensitivity and assumed superiority, but as somebody who worked in international education for years, occasionally it’s indeed necessary to explain how modern conveniences work. If you have ever only seen a toilet with an overhead tank on which there’s a string you need to pull or a hole in the ground with no flushing mechanism at all, a lever or push button might stump you.

Just as the small and large integrated push buttons built into the wall over the toilet bowl stumped those American ladies in Stuttgart (in case you are curious why there were two buttons – it’s for water saving; the small button releases a lesser amount of water).

Sometimes assuming that people from other cultures will know exactly how things work can be as harmful as assuming they know nothing.

This reminds me of when I first went off to college. I'd be chatting with a white stranger or new acquaintance and they'd casually bring up my experiences of living in the ghetto and being on welfare. At first I'd think they were mistaking me for someone else. This happened over and over again and I finally realized that those people thought they knew my life story based on movies, the news, and TV shows.

I had a similar experience when I emigrated to this country from Israel. I arrived in an Illinois town to realize have my fellow seventh graders tell me that in Israel “everyone wears sheets and rides on camels.”

I also know an immigrant from Bosnia who told me that when he came to this country people tried to teach him how to use a toilet — as if he didn’t already know!